Complaint against Red Valkyrie.

Lets just start out that I have been an admin on other sites. You must be professional, fair and logical. You do not have the luxury of being biased, emotional, and abusive.

With that said I have a complaint against Red Valkyrie. I'm not sure if she has a long standing friendship with most of the more powerful staff or even the owner of BoC. So this may just go shrugged off. She made that apparent when I complained to her about her actions.


To begin, Red had made up a new rule with Dovakiin that for every time he made some kind of complaint, insult or just a vulgar comment. He would have to give another player a compliment to level out the hate I guess. I didn't comment on this new rule of hers because I just wanted to play. Even though that when a player is making vulgar comments towards other players and insulting them in very degrading ways isn't allowed on Boc's servers and that rule shouldn't be over-ruled with a compliment to another random player. I ignored it and let it happen. I'm not an admin, I'm not anyone of importance to bring this to light.

Well this went on and Dovakiin would make an angry comment, Red would tell him "Give a compliment to someone". He would and that was the end of it. He soon left and everything was fine.

Then Bow ties are cool came online. I understand that these two have a history with each other. But again, that should not matter with how she puts out punishments. It is NOT okay to be biased.

After about 20 minutes of playing Bow Ties started to complain about the other team doing nothing but playing D. That it wasn't fun when they did that. So, Red told her new rule to Bow Ties. She asked him to comply verbally with her new guidelines and he did not.

Thats when Zesh comes into the picture. Zesh was complaining about how the server wasn't that great and how it was filled with noobs most of the time. Bow ties made a comment on the blue teams strategy and Red jumped in with her new rule. She told him to give someone a compliment and Zesh had quickly responded. "Tell me I'm a good player". He responded with "maybe later. right now you've been camping one spot with like 3 others guys since I joined". She then proceeded to ban him. She did not even know the length of time she had banned him for when I had confronted her. She said 1 to 4 hours.

Now.. I am friends with Bow ties. We chat and try to be on the same team when we play. So I know how he can be. But tonight he was not as vulgar as he usually is. He didn't insult players, he didn't argue. He just commented on the other teams strategy.

I do not have screenshots. I only have my word and the witnesses who were there that night. Much of which probably don't have an account on the forums.


After Bow ties was banned I will admit that I got some what mad. I confronted Red about her actions through Steam chat. From the conversation I had with her she expressed that "I'm an admin on a video game". Which just tells me that this does not hold much importance to her. I continued to question her and explain to her my thoughts on what she did and how they conflicted with the set rules. She shrugged me off and told me to come to the forums.


So here I am. I'm not sure what will happen. Maybe this is not a very professional establishment and events like this will be shrugged off as "Deal with it", or "Lol Who cares".

It'll be fine with me if that's the way it is. That's the owners choice. I am just expressing my opinion on something I found to be an injustice.


Red also continuously accuses me of being someone who will abuse my admin powers and kick people left and right. Which I find to be frustrating because I have not shown any signs of being a person who will do any of those things.

Before anything, let me just point out that this worked wonderfully! This dovahkin guy was only mildly rude, and it didn't warrant kicking. Instead of a a traditional warning, I tried something different. After warning him to say nice things once or twice he was actually very chilled out. He started saying things like "DAMMIT YOU... ummm are trying your best, I'm sure" or "MINISENTRIES ARE... umm... good if you know how to use them" I got a kick out of it.

I'm not an admin, but I've played with Bow Times more than a few times. The very fact that you admit you "know how he can be" and that he "wasn't as vulgar as usual" is a testament that he's a bit of a problem. You acknowledge (though in a roundabout way) that he regularly complains or is vulgar or insults people. This, to me, is reason enough to give fewer and fewer warnings to a player before taking action.

From what I've witnessed, he is incapable of going an entire round without complaining about someone's playstyle. It goes beyond simple complaints - he insults players who are just playing the game and who haven't done anything to him other than kill him, even if they don't taunt and don't say anything. He's a poor winner and he's a poor loser and a poor sport in general. He's been asked to stop and he doesn't. He brings down the mood of the server with his constant complaints and poor attitude. This isn't to say a little shit talk should be bannable - if both parties are participating, then OK. This isn't to say you can't complain - but that's what voice and teamchat is for, especially if it's about a specific player on the opposing team. He appears to be incapable of controlling his mouth (or, in this case, fingers.)

As I said, I'm not an admin on here, but I've been an admin on a different server and it's not that unusual to ban players for having a poor attitude on a continual basis. And that's what he does, and that's what he has, and that's what happened.

As for the new rule thing... that sounds to me like it was more of a way to deter someone from being a poor sport and being rude to other players, not a new rule. There's a very general "Don't be an asshole" rule in place, and it seems to me like that's what the purpose of that exercise was - keep the dude in line in a different way than just telling him to knock it off.

So your defense against what I said is that it worked? You chose to not kick someone who continuously badgering players and yelling at them for messing up on the basis that "you wanted to try something different". I didn't know that admins can make up there own rules.. or go around the ones that were already placed. I personally think that if someone is upsetting the other players then they should be punished as said in the rules.

Now on topic, and in my defense. The rule is as follows:
7. Clan/General Disrespect. Cursing at, calling names etc to a Brothers of Chaos member is never allowed whether you meant it or not. Being an all around idiot to everyone in the server is also not allowed. This will be determined by an admin whether you are or not.
Penalty: Kick or Ban

I have warned Bowties enough that to be honest, I should be permabanning him by now. I am going to next time. I am more than a little tired of his attitude, and refusal to listen to admins. He broke a rule, and I punished him in accordance with our rules.

It's not a "new rule" its more of a "creative warning".



Edit: I also gave Bowties warnings, he chose to ignore them. Also, the ban was 1 hour.

In reply to Hal Jordan. Yes, when a person continuously comes around and badger other players then you should be more short with them. Giving less warnings then you would another player. I have seen this happen. But Bow ties was not very vulgar. Its like instead of giving warnings, its been shortened to, Say one thing I don't like and your banned for the rest of the night. Which I think Red had said during gameplay. Now, another comment you made interests me. Every time I see Bow ties do his thing, people reply. They talk shit back to him. Its a back and forth thing. Zesh was baiting him. He didn't even reply in a super vulgar way. Just because he didn't follow the little guidelines that Red put forth he got banned when it wasn't a bannable offense. I think, that. Was wrong. If he got banned for doing what he usually does then yeah. I wouldn't be here posting this. I'd be playing Tf2.

This is Bow Ties. Honestly I never even noticed her saying anything to me. I knew Red Valk was on so I commented to Atomisk before I even joined that I would be sure to play it cool since she doesn't like me. So I wasn't even looking at chat much beyond replying to a statement that Vorantei (I think that was his name?) made about being here for hours and getting tired with the other team dragging out the game. I assume she copy/pasted something in chat then about the rule? So then I saw the question from Zesh, which I hadn't even spoken to tonight at all, and I replied almost verbatim as Atomisk said here.

Yes, I get frustrated easily at the general laisez faire attitude a lot of people have in TF2 to completing objectives. So I've berated people for things like that. Generally it's asking the enemy team to break the stalemate and complete the objectives of the map though. They joined a CTF map, I should not spend 40mins on the server without them even making an attempt to take our intel, let alone even leave their base. If they wanted to camp, they could be doing that on a CP map where that's actually the objective of the map.

But I find it rather poor form to randomly dole out temp-bans when I wasn't attacking anyone personally or swearing. And apparently Zesh was baiting me in his question, knowing that what he had been doing would not warrant a compliment from me. Chat is easily overlooked when you are playing, especially as a Pyro where I'm concentrating on reflects and aiming flare shots, etc. If she wants to make sure I knew her new rule that isn't written anywhere, then she should have popped over to my team and said it on voicechat to make sure I saw it.

Addendum about the CTF: If they would just let someone win/lose then the teams would rebalance and the pace and probably skill balance on each side would be a lot more even. Is the point I make.

When I play and Bow Ties happens to join, I just see him insult other players (myself included) for them playing in a way he doesn't agree with. Have I replied once or twice? Yeah. Usually I ignore him, and I don't continue anything. Yet, off he goes, making fun of however I play.

Every. Single. Time.

He does this with other players who just as frequently return fire as they ignore him. I know I said back and forth shit-talk is fine in most cases, but that doesn't mean that the guy who starts fights with people because he disagrees with how they play should get a pass because he annoys people enough to respond. After you've been warned, you should knock it off and try to not do it again. He's been warned, and he hasn't even tried to stop, at least from what I've observed.

He didn't break that rule. What your saying is that you "warned him in the past so I banned him now". He didn't call anyone names, He wasn't cursing, and all he did was decide to not follow your little exercise. You gave no warnings to him at all for that matter.

This is exactly how I feel. I have warned him in enough previous sessions that he should know better. No warnings from now on. Next time I see anything remotely close to rudeness come out of him it's gonna be a permaban.

That's not alright Red. Who are you to make such a decision? Perma-banninga player from a server such as this is a huge thing. I'm sure he's been playing for a long time. How about talking it out with him and keeping him around instead of just saying "Bah fuck it I'll just perma-ban him". To me, thats the easy and more destructive route. Talking shit constantly isnt something that deserves a perma-ban. It may be in some of the more smaller servers who are not very successful. But this server has more then 18k players and a lot of regulars. You have to think more about your actions and not just take the easy route.

I'm not his babysitter, and have no vested interested in cultivating him into a regular player or reforming him. I'm the admin, I'm here to make sure that most people enjoy their experience, and they are not enjoying playing vs bowties.

--
Once again, I refer you to: http://www.brothersofchaos.com/forum/threads/server-rules.2332/

Particularly take note of the following:
7. Clan/General Disrespect. Cursing at, calling names etc to a Brothers of Chaos member is never allowed whether you meant it or not. Being an all around idiot to everyone in the server is also not allowed. This will be determined by an admin whether you are or not.
Penalty: Kick or Ban

Admins will use their discretion with regards to the issues highlighted above. They will adhere to the above guidelines however be warned I rarely kick for anything - cross me and you will simply find yourself banned.

In comparison to our server owner, who wrote those rules, I am being more than fair. I'm sorry that you disagree, but that's how it is. As far as I'm concerned, this is the end of the discussion.

You've only been here for a year though. Your nobody to be making such a decision Red. More then fair? Compared to what? Your not even on regularly to say you see this ALL the time. I'm on, ALL the time. I play about 8 to 12 hours a day on Boc's servers. Yeah, I don't really have much of a social life. But to me, you don't have the time spent on the server nor the long standing membership of the Boc clan to make this decision. I think your logic is clouded by what has happened between you two in the past and that needs to be resolved.

I never even saw your new interpretation of the rule Valk. And nothing I said tonight was attacking anyone in particular. In fact I was REPLYING to statements from a team member about what he said he had seen tonight happening on the server. Your admin replies don't show up in the chat log either, since you use some kind of mod that puts it in a different color above where chat happens. Otherwise I would have probably seen them like I saw the question from Vorantai and Zesh.

I fail to see how I did anything close to breaking Rule #7 tonight?

Like it or not, she's an admin. Welcome to the forums, although I wish it wasn't under these circumstances. You do complain a lot and people do complain about you.

[03:28] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([571] Bow Ties Are Cool): then shitheads spams his faggot pistol like the crutching scrub he is

[03:29] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([571] Bow Ties Are Cool): you're a fucking crutching noob I dont care. exploit and crutch all you want

[03:34] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([571] Bow Ties Are Cool): exactly. at least you realize you're a shithead Keyboard

[03:34] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([551] NameRemoved): bowties, really, chill out

[06:24] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([580] Bow Ties Are Cool): faggot is camping in his spawn and charges me as I go by rofl

[06:32] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([580] Bow Ties Are Cool): welp night follks. red doesnt want to play. im tired of wasting my time on people that like ruining the game

[06:44] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([564] NameRemoved): You all have a good one. Hopefully Bow doesn't come back and try hard again.

[10:24] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([819] Bow Ties Are Cool): yeah meet you in the sewers where your sticky spamming faggotry puts you at a huge advantage?

[10:28] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([819] Bow Ties Are Cool): rofl see? you're a fucking failure

[10:34] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([819] Bow Ties Are Cool): fuck you too super sting for being hte same shithead coward as noire
[10:36] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([819] Bow Ties Are Cool): FAGGOTS IN SERVER BRO
[11:24] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([819] Bow Ties Are Cool): could you guys just fucking lose if you arent gonna play?

[11:32] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([819] Bow Ties Are Cool): you're such a faggot
[11:33] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([819] Bow Ties Are Cool): indeed your plan is to be the biggest trolling assbeads possible
[11:35] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([819] Bow Ties Are Cool): oh look mini turret failure goes to nooberty launcher scrub instead. shocking.
[11:40] <@BoC|Bot> Server 1> ([819] Bow Ties Are Cool): fucking dragging this shit out for no reason

Atomisk. It doesn't matter how long they've been admin, or registered or anything. The point is that we as a clan trusted her with these privileges and her judgement. I'm sorry he's your friend, but from what I just pasted from my logs your "friend" can't handle TF2. Anger issues much?

Also you yourself said your little brother plays here. Is this what you want him to see? All the vulgarity and hate for people who are different?

That is certainly an excessive amount of usage of the f word. I thought that that word was a part of the auto ban filter, was it not? I've always considered it a racial slur, considering Homosexuals are a race of people (I believe that's how the law deems, anyways).

Also, Red, I love the though of that rule. I would like to see more of it, personally.